CodePath EES2024 VERIZON - I’m a Cybersecurity Threat Intelligence Pro: AMA

Hi everyone. Hello. Hello.

Hello. If you’re joining from the east coast, thanks for still rocking with us, hanging out with us. Welcome to the AMA session hosted by Wayne Archerold, who is a great volunteer with CodePath and currently works at Verizon.

Super excited to have you all join us today. I’m going to introduce Wayne in just a second, but just first a couple of reminders before we get started. You can use the chat to share your thoughts and have conversations during the session, but please keep the topics relevant to what is being discussed in the session.

And then remember that the presenters and speakers can see what you’re posting in the chat. Our team will also be monitoring the chat and you’ll have a chance to ask answer questions or have your questions answered during the session and then following the session we just ask you to complete a brief feedback survey. So, I am going to introduce our speaker, Wayne Archbold, a seasoned and dedicated cyber security professional specializing in orchestrating comprehensive security strategies that safeguard organizations from evolving threats.

For over 15 years, Wayne successfully implemented robust security strategies, conducted risk assessments, and developed and managed incident response programs. He works diligently to create a security conscious culture as he continues to grow as a leader. In his current role, Wayne is an associate director with the Verizon Threat Management Center or TMC.

The TMC is the first line in defending Verizon’s networks and information systems from misuse and attacks. The TMC has an integral role in driving forward the security intelligence and capabilities in cyber defense. Wayne holds a bachelor from Howard University and a master of science degree from the George Washington University.

He also holds professional certifications including the compia security plus and compia project plus certifications. In his spare time, he volunteers his time to develop and lead many DEI initiatives and enjoys mentoring, tutoring, health and wellness activities, reading, traveling, watching TV and movies and listening to music. Wayne lives in Maryland with his family who inspires him daily.

Show some love in the chat and welcome Wayne to the stage. Thank you very much. So excited to be here.

Thank you everyone. Happy National cyber security awareness month. And it’s very awesome that I’m here to talk to you about my favorite subject today cyber security.

Let me see. And there we go. All right.

Next slide please. All right. So, what is this thingy that call cyber security?

You know, we hear a lot about it, a lot about it in the news. And I like this definition because that this definition to me sums up gives you a beautiful picture of what cyber security actually is. The protection of computer systems and networks from attacks by malicious actors that may result in unauthorized information disclosure, theft of or damage to hardware, software and or data.

So, you know, today everything relies on computers and the internet. When you think about communication with our smartphones and tablets, entertainment with our interactive video games and social media, transportation with our navigation systems, online shopping and the list goes on and on. Wherever there is technology, there needs to be cyber security because implementing cyber security best practices is important for all people as well as organizations of all sizes to protect personal, financial and sensitive information.

Next slide, please. All right. So if you remember one thing today, remember the three objectives of cyber security, they are confidentiality, integrity and availability.

This is also known as the CIA triad and this is the model that is used to help in the development of all security policies. So confidentiality ensures that unauthorized individuals are not able to gain access to sensitive information. So we all have our smartphones and we all use our passcodes or our fingers or our face to unlock the phones and when we do that that tells the phone that we are authorized to go into that device look at all the information and use all the applications.

Integrity ensures that there are no unauthorized changes to information or systems either intentionally or unintentionally. So, the presentation I made today, I wanted to make sure that it was wonderful for everyone here, and I didn’t want anyone to get in there and mess it up. So what you’re seeing is what I created, and that’s integrity.

Availability ensures that information and systems are ready to meet the needs of legitimate users at the time those users request them. So, right now, we all agreed to be here at this time. We all agreed to you know, be here.

I agreed to be on camera and because all the networks are up and running and I am here I’m authorized to be on this platform the availability is working. You know when you’re sitting at home last night I was home I wanted to watch Deadpool and Wolverine at that time and it was available for me because everything was running smoothly and that’s what availability is all about. Next slide please.

So one of the reasons cyber security is so important is to stop cyber crime. Cyber crime costs include damage and destruction of data, stolen money, lost productivity, theft of personal and financial data and much more. Global cyber crime costs expected to grow by 15% per year over the next five years, reaching to $10.5 trillion annually by 2025.

And this is up from $3 trillion, you know, just nine years ago. Now, when you think about it, looking at the chart on the left, you know, we’re talking about 11.5 million, about 11.4 million when you break it down per minute, you know, and we’ve been talking here for about four or five minutes. So, in the short space that we’ve been here, there’s been about $57 million in cyber crime damages.

Next slide, please. So as the world becomes increasingly reliant on technology, the attack surface of cyerspace continues to expand. All the new devices, all the new technologies, with that be comes more threats.

So it’s important that we examine these top threats that we face every single day. Unlike traditional hacking techniques, social engineering focuses on extracting information by exploiting psychology and reading the inter reading the interaction patterns of humans. We’re all kind people and sometimes people manipulate our kindness.

So cyber criminals manipulate human psychology to encourage the sharing of confidential information and this can include stealing login credentials or banking details or unknowingly making you you know install malicious software on your device. As organizations increasingly rely on thirdparty relationships for various aspects of their operations, the associated risk of using third parties have become more pronounced and it is critical that we address the risks. So you know most companies don’t have like their own billing system for example we you know you this company we would get this company as a third party to run the billing system if that company happens to have a breach or a hack or some other type of cyber attack then you in turn can also be you know see damages from that attack.

Cloud service providers invest heavily in security infrastructure by offering encryption, distributed denial of service protection and identity management services and more. And the cloud is pretty pretty much just space somewhere else. They’re massive data warehouses all over the country, all the world and you rent space for that.

I back up everything on my phone in the cloud. That way if I lose my phone, I can always go and retrieve that information on my new phone. But while cloud services offer many benefits, they also present unique security challenges including potential data breaches, insecure data storage, account hijacking, and more.

You know, so you know, failure to apply timely security updates for these services and patches to cloud-based applications. This can expose vulnerabilities that attackers can exploit to gain unauthorized access or compromised data. Ransomware is a type of malicious software designed to encrypt or block access to a victim’s files or computer systems until a ransom is paid to attackers.

So, usually what happens is you’ll get an email. The email would have a link or an attachment. You’ll download something on your your machine.

The machine would exe the this the download would execute and encrypt everything on your device. So encrypt basically makes means making everything unreadable. You won’t be able to access and you probably would have to get a key to decrypt you know everything to so you can get your information.

In recent years ransomware has become one of the most reoccurring forms of cyber attack. The average ransom demand in 2021 was 5.3 million US. And usually companies pay some companies pay large sums but usually people they either have a backup and they back up everything so they don’t have to pay the you know the bad actors but in some cases you know they just negotiate and sometimes it comes from five down from 5 million to maybe 200,000 and companies say well we’re willing to pay that.

These attacks cause significant disruption to individuals and organizations and they can lead data loss, financial losses due to downtime and ransom payments, reputational damage and legal and regulatory consequences. Now the internet of things refers to interconnected everyday physical devices and objects with the internet. And they are enabled to collect and exchange data.

So when you think about internet of things, you think about smartwatches, you think about smart TVs, anything that has a small computer in it. These connected devices often equipped with sensors and processes can communicate with each other with central systems without requiring human intervention. These devices are vulnerable to cyber crime due to the weak security measures.

And as we see more of these devices being built without security in mind, this increases the attack surface. And you know you can use a bunch of these device to create what they call botn nets where a bunch of devices get together and they can create large scale attacks you know so lack of updates and you know to these devices and lack of updates to firmware and software this can lead to potential attacks on these devices. Next slide please.

All right. So, you know, I want everybody to kind of look at this house and see what devices they can identify that might pose a cyber security risk. In the chat you know if you see something that could be you know could be a risk in some way to cyber security or you think could be a risk drop it in the chat and I’ll give you a few minutes and well not a few minutes but a few seconds and I’m already seeing some really great answers.

Awesome. Really really good stuff. Yeah, you guys are experts.

You guys could be teaching me this stuff. All right, next slide, please. All right.

So, yeah. So, you guys were right on the money. Any of these things connected to the internet can be attacked.

Your phone, your Wi-Fi router, your tablets, your smart TV. So, it’s important to make sure that the firmware and the software and these things are always updated. Next slide, please.

So on a personal level, the easy ways for you as an individual to stay safe online, strong passwords, multiffactor authentication, recognizing fishing attacks, updating software. Next slide, please. Yes.

So, strong passwords are always one of the best ways to secure yourself on all your devices. Most experts recommend up to 16. The National Institute of Security Standards actually just came out with a new advisory.

They’re recommending up to 64. You never want to reuse a password. The same password you use for Netflix.

You don’t want to use that for Tik Tok. You don’t want to use it for Amazon. You want to make sure you have different passwords for everything, which can sound hard.

But it is really the best way to be secure. If I have your password for Netflix, you know, you don’t want me to have passwords now for your bank account. It’s better to when you create these passwords, use a combination of upper and lowerase letters, numbers, special characters.

And you can use what they call passphrases. So passphrases are pretty much like a long sentence, but using, you know, a combination of the random suggestions that they say here. And it might be like, you know, I like Chick-fil-A sandwiches and milkshakes.

But, you know, with the S for milkshake, it might be a dollar sign. All everything will be up and lowerase letters, might throw some numbers in between there, and that, you know, can create a really strong password. Next slide, please.

You can also use what they call a password manager. This is great because it stores your passwords. It prevents you from using duplicate passwords.

So you can’t use the same password for different applications. These passwords are usually very very strong and very very long. So they you know they’re they’re very hard to kind of break.

You can automatically use the password manager to fill in your login credentials for you into websites which makes it very easy. And because the password manager doesn’t really know what the password is, you know, everything is encrypted. You can never really fall for a fishing website.

You know, you can never really give the information that you don’t have. You know, I can’t give you my password if I don’t know what it is. So, you know, these tools are very good to keep you safe.

Next slide, please. All right. So, multiffactor authentication.

This I love because, this is a great way to make sure that, you know, you really protect it. Multiffactor authentication basically means multiple ways to be authenticated. So, if I have a password, that’s a factor.

If I use my thumb, that’s a factor. In some cases, like when I log into some of my accounts, I log in with a password. It gets I get into the application, not all the way in, but it tells me, do I want to send a a key to my phone?

I get the key. I have to go back in. I use the key and the password to now authenticate to get all the access that I really need to do what I want to do.

And this it it takes the process is longer, but you know, it beats somebody getting into your into your system and stealing your data. So you can also use an a authenticator app secret key and of course biometrics. Nowadays everyone uses their phone or their face to unlock their phone.

In some cases you know if you want to be really secure you can use your your finger and you could also use a passcode. Next slide please. All right.

So use multiffactor authentication any way you can. Your you know your financial accounts, your personal accounts, your you know Tik Tok use it anywhere you can because the more secure you are you know the more the better that you you you are when it comes to doing business online. Next slide please.

All right. Now fishing to me fishing is probably the biggest threat when it comes to cyber security simply because it’s not something that’s technical. It’s something that you know you they pretty much manipulate you and get you to pretty much give them the keys to the kingdom.

So you want to look out for things like they usually have a tone like do this right now or else. When that when you see emails like that just delete them. Most companies won’t really send you emails like that.

You won’t get text messages like that. You know, email addresses, you know, look at the email address when that that’s you get email emails from. If they’re misspelled, like in the case here where you have Amazon.com, but is with the zero instead of an O, that’s a clear indicator that it’s not from Amazon.

Unexpected communication. You’re getting an email that you’re not expecting. Netflix telling you that your account, you’re locked out of your account.

You haven’t paid your bill, etc. You’re not expecting that. It’s probably somebody trying to fish you. Request a personal information.

Never do this ever. Misspelled words and bad grammar. I used to see this a lot maybe 10 years ago when a lot of the bad actors overseas and English is their second or third language.

But now with AI, you don’t see that much. Usually a lot of these emails are very sophisticated. Next slide, please.

All right. Things to do and things to not do. By all means, do not click on a link in an email.

You know, you just never know what’s going to happen after that. Don’t download an attachment. And if you do download an attachment, definitely don’t open it.

Don’t send personal information online or share over the phone. And in terms of personal information online, you know, on another note, because I always like to bring this up when we’re talking about cyber security, always watch what you post online. Everything you put put out there lives forever.

I know with a lot of companies that I work with, when we’re looking for candidates, we Google them and we see if they’re a good fit for our company, if they have good moral standards. This also college recruiters do it. So, always make sure that anything I always tell people if you’re posting something online, make sure it’s something that your priest or your grandmother would approve of.

But now, back to fishing. What you should do, verify the communication is real. You know, contact the sender.

If Amazon sends you something you’re not sure, go to, you know, their sites, Google them, reach out to them and say, "Hey, did you send me this communication?" They’ll verify it for you. Report it to the IT department or the company. We get at Verizon people telling us every day that they’re being fished from a fake Verizon site or someone who claims to be a FiOS tech or FIOS representative.

You know, just report it to us or any other company. Use email filters. A lot of emails nowadays have filters to block out a lot of the stuff, but a lot of stuff still get through.

But email filters are very very good to make sure that you block out as much fishing emails as possible. Next slide please. And you know by all means always update your software.

I have this fight with my mother all the time because she doesn’t update anything. But when you update your software you’re making sure that your phone has the the the latest software with the best protection for your device. Don’t click on the remind me later.

Do it as soon as possible. It only takes a few minutes and it’s going to make sure that most secure. Definitely automatic updates are great.

You know, they’re up, you know, they’re great and a great way to stay secure because you really don’t have to do anything. Everything is kind of done for you. Next slide, please.

To find your, you know, find a way to update it. Usually, if you go to settings in most of your device devices, they will tell you where to go to find the updates. Sometimes, you know, they might be in the browser or the app settings, but, you know, a lot of times when I can’t find something, I just Google it.

And everything is out there and I just find out what I need, you know, what the information that I need. But definitely make sure that everything is always up to date. Next slide, please.

All right. So let’s talk a little bit about what people in my field actually do. You know cyber security analysts they’re very important in safeguarding organizations digital assets.

You know they stay continually vigilant. They say they strategize against threats such as targeted ransomware attacks and sophisticated scams that attempt to deceive users. They ensure data security by implementing robust security protocols like internet protocol security IPS and transport data security TLS.

They man they manage a range of security software from antivirus solutions to systems for managing passwords and other security credentials in the complex web of network traffic. Detecting anomalies can be like finding a needle in a hay stack. I mean you can imagine you know the kind of network traffic that we have at Verizon with the you know the hundred millions of people that we have as customers using our services every day.

These analysts leverage network traffic an analysis tools to evaluate network data and identify potential security incidents. Next slide please. So a little bit just about what I do.

As a a leader in cyber security, my role is different. So I lead a security operation center. We assess risk.

We use a lot of tools to detect things. I enhance workflows and processes. I love kind of developing strategies for what we’re going to do and how we’re going to keep our customers safe.

I work with my team to do reviews and make sure that they have the right skills to do their job. And the best part of my job is motivating and mentoring and training all of my team members because the better employees I have the better we can serve our comp our customers and keep them secure. Next slide please.

Okay. So why should anyone think about a career in cyber security? And there are many reasons but these are just a few that speak to me personally.

The cyber security field is facing a significant challenge talent shortage especially here in the US with millions of jobs opening globally globally due to the expanding digital landscape. So this persistent gap between the demand for skilled cyber security professionals and the supply ensures robust job security and abundant opportunities. Cyber security professionals enjoy some some of the highest salaries in the tech sector reflecting the critical nature of their roles and the shortage of qualified candidates.

Even entry-level positions in cyber security command command higher salaries compared to other tech jobs with the potential for rapid advancement and increased earnings as experience and skills develop. The cyber security industry offer a wide array of of career paths to suit different skills and interests. Whether you’re drawn to the technical side of securing IT infrastructures, the analytical aspects of risk management or strategic involvement in cyber security policy, there is probably a place for you.

In the realm of cyber security professionals have a unique opportunity to make a tangible impact on society by protecting sensitive information and safeguarding digital infrastructures. We play a critical role in preventing data breaches, identify the identity theft, and other cyber crimes that can have de devastating effects on individuals and communities. And I like this one a lot because every day I get up and I go to work and I really feel like I’m making a different protecting our customers because that to me is very important.

Another great benefit that I love personally is a flexible work environment. So I’m in my home office right now. This is where I work most of the time.

And for the most part, this field often offers the flexibility to work in various settings including remote, in office or hybrid models. And this adapt adaptability caters to different lifestyles and personal preferences making it possible for professionals to tailor their work environments to their needs. You know whether it’s an option to work from home which helps with the balance of personal life and job duties or the dynamic of collaborating with global teams from anywhere.

These careers provide substantial flexibility that can enhance job satisfaction and overall quality of life. Next slide, please. All right.

So, if you wanted to get into this field today and you’re a student, there are a lot of things you can do right now. If you’re in high school or even elementary school, you can do things like advanced math, computer science, but even things like art. You know because we do a lot of things creatively especially in terms of cyber investigations creative writing that helps me a lot because I do a lot a lot writing for documents that I have to update presentations I have to make to senior leadership but even things like ethics and government as you go on to college of course cyber security is a great major computer science software engineering but even things like communications other things you can do, you can join a cyber security club.

Or you can even start one. There’s a lot of great resources online telling you how to create clubs. You can ask your teacher to integrate cyber security concepts such as the CIA triad into your existing lesson plans.

And you could talk to your counselor about a future career in cyber security. Next slide, please. So you know these are the skills that I tell every security analyst and future analyst that they should have.

Technical skills are important. Degrees for a lot of the careers is is you know it it helps. There are some jobs where you really don’t need a degree like if you want to be a security developer.

But you know you should also I always encourage languages. I don’t write code, but I always think that it’s always great just for that type of analytical thinking. Knowing things like network security and proficiency in operating systems.

Soft skills to me are more important because I always tell people and my mentor always says this, you can teach anyone technical skills, but soft skills sometimes is, you know, they’re a lot harder to pick up and a lot harder to learn. So communication is key. If you can’t communicate, it’s going to be very hard in this field.

You have to communicate with your team, your leaders. You have to be able to get the message out and be able to kind of explain everything and know what you’re doing. Collaboration and teamwork very important.

I meet a lot of people who think this field is all about working in a silo. That doesn’t happen. I’ve been in this field for many years and have many jobs.

I’ve never worked by myself ever. Critical thinking, logic, logical reasoning and it’s always good to stay up to date on what’s happening in the trends and emerging technologies things change fast. When I got into this field we weren’t worried about things like ransomware and deep fakes and AI you know but now that’s what we’re dealing with now and who knows what we’re going to deal with tomorrow.

Next slide please. All right. So, like I said, there’s lots of career options.

Lots. I’ve probably had about five or six of these jobs while I’ve been in this field. Some of the top ones right now are penetration testers, software developers, of course, analyst, cyber defense.

But you know, whatever speaks to you, there is a role for you. And this is just a fraction of what’s out there. Next slide, please.

All right. So like I said this one of the main benefits this field can be very rewarding you know mainly because of the demand there’s a shortage of skills and you know it sometimes it can come with a lot of stress that you don’t find in other fields but you know if you Google what the average salary is you’re going to see a lot of numbers I kind of like this number in terms of the average salary being about 100,000 because that to me is somewhat accurate. Of course, this all depends on your skills.

So, entry level usually starts around 75 80,000. I think that’s what my junior analysts start at something like that. And then you know as you move on your career gets higher and you know as you can see it goes up to 131,000.

Most leaders that I know make much more than that. And some jobs even depending on the job in cyber security pays more than that. But as you can see in terms of career with the top 20 growing career you know in terms of projected jobs over the next couple of years you can see that we’re close to the top and there are a lot of open roles in the US almost half a million and then worldwide you know they’re millions.

So there’s a lot of opportunity out here for for people who want to get into this exciting field. Next slide, please. And this is just an example of salaries based on what you’re actually doing.

So like I said, analysts they’re in the 70 80 range depending. And as they move on, they can make as much as 100 maybe even more. Specialists, penetration testers is a hot field right now.

You know, you see that you know, most experienced ones can make about 107. In some cases, people are even getting paid about 200,000 a year to to be a penetration tester. So, you know, there are the the the salaries vary by whichever career path you take, but either way, you will be rewarded very nicely.

Next slide, please. All right. And this brings me to the end of the presentation, but you know, if you want to learn more about cyber security, there are a lot of resources out here.

Two of my favorite resources. The cyber security and infrastructure security agency. They actually a big they put on cyber security awareness month.

There’s a lot of stuff out there about how to stay safe online and things that you can take, you know, to teach your parents and your friends. And the National Cyber Security Alliance, they have a lot of good information, too. And of course there are a lot of other great resources out there.

But always make sure that you are getting information from a valid source, whether it’s cyber security or whatever you do. Always make sure that it’s from a reputable source because that’s the only way you’re going to actually learn what is actually real. So, next slide, please.

At this point, I will take any questions that you have. All right. Thank you, Wayne, for that presentation.

I’m rethinking every password I’ve ever created now. We have about 10 minutes. Let’s see how many questions we can get through.

But our couple of our top voted questions, first one is what is a day in the life like at different stages in your career? So getting into your career and starting out versus what it’s like now. Okay.

Yeah. So getting into cyber security as an analyst usually what happens is you’re going to come in you did you know the days are about you work about 40 hours a week. My analysts work 40 hours a week some work eight hours 5 days a week some work four days 10 hours a week.

But they come in they look at their tickets that they probably had from the day before. They look at the tools that we have that signal giving detections all the time and giving alerts. They work those alerts.

They also work. We have an inbox where people send emails to us. And that’s what they do all day.

Once you get into the leadership level, then it’s more about kind of managing what they do. Creating strategies for the team to succeed. Coaching, developing, creating training plans.

Things more that you know leaders would do. So that’s the big difference more the analyst side is more like day-to-day work. The leadership side is more like strategy and where are we going in the future?

Yeah, good question. Yeah, very good question. Next question is how necessary is having a security plus or any other certification to work in cyber security?

Great question. I get that all the time. I love certificate certificates but what we’ve realized over the last I would say the industry over probably the last 10 years is that a lot of people have certificates but don’t have experience.

So depending on your role I always say experience is better than having a certificate. Having certificates teach you a general idea of what cyber security is like the security plus but you know if it’s when I’m hiring people if I have a guy who’s very versed in like security management tools and some of the other tools we use and a guy who’s never done it but he has a certificate I’ll probably go with the guy who has all the experience so I say go with both but if I had to pick one definitely experience Awesome. Next question.

What would be the best way to impress cyber recruiters? I have a security plus certification and personal projects like attacking and defending my own VM. Nice.

Yeah, cool. The best thing to do I would say is just apply as much as possible. The job market is there are a lot of jobs out there but the job market is very strange.

Where sometimes you never really look know what they’re looking for. So definitely apply to as as much people as possible. I was just talking to one of my mentees today.

He probably sent out a couple hundred applications. He finally got a job. But definitely make sure that a professional has looked at your resume, so your resume is on point.

Practice interviewing. And be ready to talk about the things that you’ve done with the VM wares and stuff because these things are going to be these are probably the things when they see your resume, these are things they’re going to ask you. Tell me about a time about you did this.

What was it for? How did you what did you contribute to the project? And how did you make it successful?

So be prepared to answer those types of questions because that’s more than likely the kind of stuff they’re going to ask you. Okay, good question. Thanks Wayne for that.

Yeah, good question. Next question. This is a good one, too.

What was the spark that motivated the change from software engineering to threat intel? Was it a specific cyber related event or an intentional pivot? Yeah, very good question.

I went to grad school while I was working. Danny and I actually went to the same graduate school, George Washington University. And while I was there, I was a software developer.

And being a software developer is okay, but basically you’re basically doing the same thing over and over again. There’s usually an eightweek cycle or a four-week cycle where you’re doing the same thing over and over and over again. And once I finished my graduate degree, I just wanted to do something where I can use my mind more and things can change, you know, I can do things that change more and cyber security really spoke to me because things were constantly evolving.

So when I got the opportunity, I never really worked in cyber security before, but I jumped in with both feet because I was just bored with writing code. Some people love it. I found it extremely boring.

And it could be my OCD, too. I just can’t do the same thing for a long time, which is why I can’t play video games because it’s just boring to me. But good question.

Yeah, these are really awesome questions, everyone. Let’s see if we have time for maybe one or two more. What about threat intelligence excites you?

What is your favorite artifact and why? Oh, what excites me the most? The most about threat intelligence is the analysis part of it.

We get some cases that we get are pretty much things that we see a lot of but there are sometime sometimes we get that one case where that we’ve never seen before and just working through that case doing all the analyzing and trying to figure it out. And a lot of times I’m working with other analysts. I might be working with legal I might be working with people from different business groups.

I like that kind of excitement. And you know the drive and you know because you have to you’re trying to work these things out as quickly as possible. And that really I like that a lot.

That excites me a lot. Awesome. Let’s do one more quick question before we end the session.

I’m pulling this from the chat. Working in thread intelligence, how many industries do you keep track of and how do you do so? Okay.

With Verizon, I pretty much we’re I’m mostly concerned with our customers. But you brought up a good question in terms of how many industries we keep track of. We keep track of all of them.

Every single one. Why? If AT&T, for example, has a breach, they’re also in the communications and technology field, we could be next.

So, we’re going to jump into proactive mode and look at everything we’re doing. Look at all the relationships we have with AT&T because they’re a third party. If Disney gets hacked, if Amazon get gets hacked, we do business with all these people.

So, anytime something happens with any company that we have a relationship with, I have to be a part of it. So, I’m always up to date with everyone and everything within the industry. Yeah.

All right. Unfortunately, yeah, great question. Unfortunately, we have to end the session there.

Hopefully, you all can connect with Wayne if you have further questions you want to ask him on LinkedIn. Thank you so much Wayne for leading a very fascinating chat about cyber security. Show some appreciation for Wayne in the chat.

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